The collected works of pentium - Page 2

Well done!
You have made alot of people happy tonight!

It's a good thing I keep track of people I used to work with.
One of my friends knew a friend who heard that the place they worked at was getting rid of some short lengths of Mixed end fiber optic cable.
A week, one photo and a quarter tank of gas later I made arrangements to pick up what appears to be several (more than 15) 20 foot lengths of SC-ST, SC-SC and ST-ST cable next Wednesday.
Since hubs, transceivers and cards are getting cheaper (and since almost all my computers are in the same part of the house) I thought it might be nice to finally upgrade from my tangle of 10Mbit BNC ThinNet, 10Mbit CAT 5e, 100Mbit CAT 5e, AppleTalk and Token Ring to just Token ring (so I can network my old AIX 1.3 box) and Fiber.
The cables I am getting should cover most of my computer room however I'm not going to get all the systems. So far, it will look like I will need seven PCI fiber cards and seven AUI fiber transceivers. If I get a fiber card for the Onyx and the Indy we can take out two transceivers. If I can find two Sbus Fiber cards for the SUN systems, I can take out two more transceivers.
The only systems that I don't think I can network are my macs (both PCI and NuBus) and my Intel (white box) NeXTStep 3.3 system.

The only items I currently have that are related to fiber are two FORE ATM cards for the Crimson and Onyx and a card installed in my Indigo. What do you think?

Cool, you got it going.

Yeah, one of the floppy images kept getting corrupt so I had to use that alternative.
Bummer I only have a 160Mb ESDI drive and nothing else to control a drive with. I can't load all the software.
I might like to see if I can load everything to tape though.

I hope you're not mixing up ethernet over fiber (using transceivers), FDDI and ATM. They all use more or less the same medium (fiber) but the protocol layer is of course totally incompatible so you can't mix them.

Oh, I know I can't use the FORE cards. I'm just going to pray that the card in the Indigo operates on the right protocol however I have a feeling it is FDDI (two ports on it).

So what you are attempting to tell me is that the drawbacks to fiber is the power the switch takes and it's rather proprietary.
The thing here is that electricity is cheaper where I live network cable is horrendously expensive here (copper is like gold right now) and if Five meters of fiber costs less than fifteen feet of regular CAT 5e/6e after taxes I really think it would be nice.
To me, the only expensive parts are the cards, and the switch. ST AUI transceivers, while slow are incredibly cheap these days.

I don't think there is any LC cables in the pile.
Well, I guess I'll stick with what I got then but I still strongly think that it would be better than what I am living with now.

I picked them up today.with the exception of one cable, they are all 20 foot SC to ST cables and a quick check shows that none of them have damage to their fiber core (at least no real breakage). Unfortunately only a few came with dust caps.

EDIT: Not only did it arrive fast but it was also installed fast. In less than an hour I had strung sixteen lengths of fiber to almost every computer I own so at the very least I am fiber ready however if I were to go completely Fiber I would need the following:

8 x AUI ST Fiber transceivers
8 X AUI extension leads (6" extension cord that allows me to move the transceiver around)
1 x AAUI ST fiber transceiver (I know where to get one too)
2 x ST Fiber PCI network cards (capable of at least 100Mb/s)
1 x SC Fiber PCI network card (capable of at least 100Mb/s)
1 x 16 port SC fiber switch (the most expansive part)

That would amount to approximately $100 which really seems not much more of an improvement over the cost of Copper gigabit.

And as Jan said, switches will also be hot and noisy.

Useless to mention but what the heck.
My server/router room is both air chilled (draws air through underground pipe which keeps the room at a nice 10 degrees) and it's encased in a styrofoam shell that quiets down the Proliant server quite nicely (sister's bedroom is next to the server room and she ca barely hear it).
In other words, my server/router room is an old concrete floor/insulated wall root cellar.

Mmmmm...
MCI and ESDI.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/ballsandy/Computer%20related/P1010201.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/ballsandy/Computer%20related/P1010202.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/ballsandy/Computer%20related/P1010203.jpg

anyone having those 4MB 80ns SIMMs it takes and willing to part with them?

I might have a few left over (they also work really well in my laser printer) however I'm too busy right now to go and dig them out.
Yeah, the rework on the dallas chip was more of an experiment that worked. Too bad I can't find a bigger ESDI drive. You can't install everything on a 160Mb drive and hope to have lots of free space left over.

How common were these systems and how much are they now?
I want to pool up my money and finally go beyond a 300Mhz PowerPC mac and get something real nice that is still "a Mac". Intel processors belong in a pc, not in a mac. A dual might also be reasonable.

Those MASSIVE 30" apple LCD monitors are an ultimate dream.
It's so big I can't even think of what to fill the screen with.
BTW, how are the G5 processors when it comes to running more modern mac software on them?

Okay then, what specifically should I be looking for?

Oh dear, this is getting a bit out of hand.
I just assumed that so long as I stuck to the ethernet protocol while using fiber I would be fine.
I was wrong...very wrong.
so, what you are telling me is that switching to fiber will not be as easy as getting cards for all my systems, getting all the cable and purchasing a metal box that turns an optical connection into something that I can plug into my Linksys WRT54G into?

nekonoko wrote:

pentium wrote: Oh dear, this is getting a bit out of hand.
I just assumed that so long as I stuck to the ethernet protocol while using fiber I would be fine.

FDDI and optical fibre fast ethernet are not the same thing.

To quote a wise man on the first page of this thread:

jan-jaap wrote: I hope you're not mixing up ethernet over fiber (using transceivers), FDDI and ATM. They all use more or less the same medium (fiber) but the protocol layer is of course totally incompatible so you can't mix them.

If memory serves correct:
-Ethernet over fiber is really no different than regular ethernet.
-FDDI works in the same way token ring does.
-ATM will make your head explode if you fail to fail to grasp the concept of packet switching.

That being said, this would mean that I would require at the least a conversion from the FDDI protocol to the Ethernet over fiber protocol. If I wanted to use my two ATM cards in the Onyx and Crimson, I would then have to convert both ATM and FDDI to Ethernet over fiber. Then we got to remember that the FDDI and ATM converters as well as the Cisco gear will give off quite a bit of heat.

Why does networking have to suck so much?

Bah!
The latch that holds my DUO book 230 to the mini dock jammed and one of the arms broke off when I tried to free it. Now I can't get a reliable connection and it looks like it's time to upgrade. Anyone have a spare DUO Dock lying around?

To complicate things further, getting good drivers for IRIX systems is a challenge, even with SGI-made network interfaces (the old Challenge L/XL ATM cards, for example). You'll often find cards that only have IRIX 6.2 drivers, or 6.3 drivers, or 6.4 drivers, or even 5.3 drivers, and for cards that have 6.5 drivers, they often have serious glitches.

Luckily I do have the Irix 6.2 and 6.5 driver for my ATM cards however even before you said that they are a complicated thing to setup I had doubts on using them anyways. My alternative for the two desksides, should ATM networking not work, was to just plug in an AUI transceiver and live with a 10 Base fiber ethernet connection. Speaking of that, the majority of the network was to be made from either fiber ethernet PCI cards or AUI ethernet over fiber transceivers with a 100 base speed required for only three systems (at the least) and the rest running at 10 base which is okay with me unless I have to start moving big files around.
The only system I own that would show an incompatibility with ethernet over fiber would be my Indigo. It has an FDDI card installed.

Speaking of FDDI, look what popped up on ebay. Too bad it only has a CDDI board though. What you recommend is something like this.

From denmark?
I don't I can afford that kind of shipping.

You know what, I think I'll stay with what I got for a little longer.

josehill wrote:

pentium wrote: The latch that holds my DUO book 230 to the mini dock jammed and one of the arms broke off when I tried to free it. Now I can't get a reliable connection and it looks like it's time to upgrade. Anyone have a spare DUO Dock lying around?

You might try posting a WTB at the Low End Mac Swap List - http://groups.google.com/group/lemswap

I gave up on posting there.
Nobody ever responds to me.

Yellowing is fine.
Perhaps if you find it, you can take it with you to Vancouver and while there send it to me via Canada post. It will make the shipping a bit cheaper.

You found some Model 95's?!
Oh man, I have been looking for one or two of those systems!
Well I guess at the very least you have mare than enough spare parts to make at least one very nice system.

Oh, I envy you.
You got some really nice systems to play with.

Quite right and it would be nice to have a full DUO dock again. I got rid of my last one because the PSU was shot.

If you are looking for pure-power in a Mac , go for an Intel

Those two words should NEVER be in the same sentence.

Okay, here's something that I thought of today.

Assuming that we were using 10/100 ethernet over fiber, is there a hub/switch (I always get them mixed up) that I can use that will concentrate several SC fiber connections into a single 10/100/1000 Cat 5e (or a similar connection) uplink?
We will leave the FDDI issue alone for now. I just want to know if we can do what I just asked.
I'm thinking of either making an individual system to bridge all my network connections together or bridge all my network connections together in the server where I can more easily control everything (I'm already using the server to bridge my regular network and my token ring network so why not do the same with everything else?)

EDIT: Here is the plan of doom.

tillin9 wrote: Um... Why not just put a copper GBIC into a regular Fibre hub? Something like this: http://cgi.ebay.com/New-Finisar-1000BAS ... dZViewItem

You know how stubborn I am when it comes to going copper.
EDIT: Wait, were you talking about those three gigabit uplinks?

Did you realize you need a motherboard with a dozen PCI slots in the server?

My proliant 1600 has six slots however if it causes other issues I might just build one separate system just for networking.

The Keeper wrote: What is "Fiber Over Ethernet"?

Whoops. I meant Ethernet over fiber.

If you're referencing "10Base-FL"/"100Base-FL"/"1000Base-FL" or some other variation on that theme, where it's a standard Ethernet stack that just happens to be using a fiber optic transport, then it's more accurate to say "Ethernet Over Fiber". That's relatively straightforward to set up, since most hubs/switches that expose fibre optic ethernet links also have copper ethernet links to connect to the rest of the network.

that's the one!

Three of these should do it.

*clicky*

Bummer that they don't ship to canada.
If only someone lived locally enough to pick them up for me and send them one by one as to be easier on my wallet...

Well I'm nearly there.
Yesterday I paid for 50 (yes, fifty) AUI to ST fiber transceivers so that takes care of most of my systems. Now I just need three 100Base FX ST PCI cards and three 100Base FX SC PCI cards and every computer I have will be outfitted.
Now to get the most important items. The switches.
Some may of seen that I am looking for some BayStack switches. After I have those the network should be pretty much complete and because they can be linked together I can eliminate one heck of a bottleneck between the switches.
All in all it's going to cost another $200 to finish it off but I hope to sell some of the spare AUI to ST transceivers as I really don't need that many (but it was a good deal at $20 as they are all the same and brand new).

Well I am one step closer to getting this done.
I have managed to aquire all the AUI transceivers I will ever need.
I now have 52 new transceivers so we can stroke those off the list now.
It feels great to retire the old BNC transceivers.

What does that leave me to get now?
3 x PCI 100BASE FX ST network cards
5 x PCI 100BASE FX SC network cards
2 x Baystack 28104/ADV Fiber switches
(Optional) 1 x Baystack 28115/ADV Cat 5e switch

Limiting factor: Money.
I think I can get hold of the SC cards here and at that price I could eliminate the ST cards and just buy more cable with SC connectors on both ends. The Baystack switches on the other hand will probably be (to my dismay) the last things I will get. In the mean time I will live with a media converter I have.

I think for me it was the sheer size of the things.
The first SGI I ever saw was the Personal Iris I own. It was set up in my fathers office and whenever I went to his office I would try to sneak away from my dad and turn the thing on (which still scared the heck out of me as I was the same height of this system and the fan was loud). From memory, my favorite programs were buttonfly and there was this other program (probably a demo) that displayed a 3D spider on a flat surface and you could move the camera around. I can still vividly remember calling it "the spider program" while I really sould not read at the time I still knew where it was.
Pity the system no longer wants to boot. It now sits next to me under the desk along with the monitor, keyboard and mouse that the system came with. After a bout a year of owning it I decided to look for a better system and here I am now with not only the PI but a Crimson, Onyx, Indy, Indigo and two Indigo2's.

To this day my father still wishes he had never shown me the PI in the first place. I make it up to him by paying part of the electrical bill.

Entry level for me was a Compaq Proliant 1600 with five 9.1Gb hard drives and two 500Mhz PIII processors.

I gotta agree on VP in this one.
You can get Linux to work but it is rather useless and crippled.
If you can get hold of a copy of Irix (not here though) you will be better off.